How Blue The Ocean Is - AMORA's Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction Five Years Later with Frontman Billy Zee (The Witzard Interview)
AMORA is made up of five of the sweetest, most gracious guys I've ever encountered in this industry—Billy Zee, Chris Swanson, Tristan Wikler, Bryan Rodriguez, and Nick Magidson—who, just so happen to be actively making some of the most brutal, punishing Punk/Emo/Post-hardcore (or "Lansdale Sad Punk," as they describe it) out there right now. Having shared bills in recent months with everyone from America's Got Talent contestants LILIAC to fellow Philly Punk hyphenate (insert sub-genres) phenoms Kaonashi & Being As An Ocean, I met Billy & Chris in November 2022 after a chance encounter at a The Color Fred show at Philly venue Underground Arts.
What turned into an impromptu label showcase for Fred Mascherino's (ex-Taking Back Sunday, Say Anything, The Lemonheads) Heading East Records that featured Oceans In The Sky's Liam Frost, AMORA, of course, Terrible Things—Coheed & Cambria's Josh Eppard, Hot Rod Circuit's Andy Jackson, Brian Weaver, who played on Paramore's RIOT!, and Fred Mascherino—a solo acoustic set from Jackson, and Fred doing double-duty with headliner The Color Fred playing Bend to Break in full in honor of its 15th anniversary. I met Billy & Chris in-between the night's band's sets; Billy sold me a Cutting Teeth EP cassette tape, which had just been hand-dubbed earlier the same day, and Chris & I bonded over our My Chemical Romance T-shirts that we both bought at the same concert the previous summer.
We traded Instagram handles and kept in touch over the coming months. We even got together in December 2022 for an AMORA year-end wrap-up style feature right here at The Witzard chronicling Nick, Bryan, Chris, Tristan, and Billy's favorite albums and singles of '22. I've been chatting with Billy, Chris, and the rest of the guys from AMORA ever since, brainstorming potential ideas for coverage and just shooting the sh*t. I worked with Chris and his other band, STUD WISER, on a companion track-by-track breakdown feature for their self-titled debut EP this past May, too. So, when I saw back in June that AMORA would be playing a special Five Years of Martyr anniversary show at Panico's Neighborhood Grill & Sports Tavern in Lansdale, PA on August 5, 2023 (this Saturday night!,) I immediately messaged Billy and the boys to concoct something.
This weekend's show will, of course, be commemorating the fifth anniversary of AMORA's self-released 2018 full-length debut, Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction, AKA simply Martyr. Billy & I have been texting, chatting, messaging, emailing, and talking on the phone ever since we decided to do a comprehensive interview feature about Martyr, AMORA then/now, the anniversary show at Panico's, what's next for AMORA, and much, much more. Check out our interview below, which has been lightly edited for general clarity. AMORA's Five Years of Martyr show with special guests MERIT, WESTMAN, and Vanish Cap at Panico's Neighborhood Grill & Sports Tavern in Lansdale, PA with doors to open at 8:00pm and the show starting at 8:30. Just keep an eye on AMORA’s assorted social media pages for additional updates.
I. Alright, so can you set the stage for us a bit: as a band, where was AMORA at on their career trajectory in 2018?
Billy Zee: Honestly, we were mainly just figuring ourselves out. We put our first two EP's, In Lieu Of/Wrong from Right, out in 2015-16 and just grinded on those. We were starting to do our first tours and started playing the new music on Martyr[: A Recital of Self-Destruction] at shows. We attempted to record the record ourselves as a four-piece and may [have] recorded around half the record until we realized we could really benefit from someone else coming in and guiding the way. This was, also, around the time [when] Chris Swanson (guitar and vocals) came into the picture and helped take things to a new level.
II. Without getting too explicit or specific, what were some of events and emotions that helped inspire the lyrical content heard across Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction?
Zee: I call it a coming-of-age record. Some of the songs were [written], lyrically, a lot longer before they [became] actual songs. The record is mainly about growing up. The songs were the outlet of many situations, such as break-ups and relationships, drug addictions, family problems, personal problems, [and] watching your role models "die" in front of you—and not "die" as in death, but as in who you thought they were. These songs, too, were [written] in the time frame of being around 17-21 years old [with] some lyrical content dating back before [then]. The bridge of "Hearthstone" was ripped from another song I wrote when I was in high school and learning about a friend (the same [one] "Hearthstone" is about,) at the time, that attempted to kill his abusive dad and go down a dark path. What’s crazy is that this is only one of those stories and it happened at such a young age; some of this stuff became sadly normal in our lives and we had to unlearn that.
III. What can you tell us about "the rock" in Green Lake Park, Pennsylvania where the band, a model, and Katya Ivanovski shot the original Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction cover image?
Zee: One time, I had such an idea of the cover that I practically forced it on the band to say "yes." Looking back, I shouldn't have done that, but I was so set on it and at the end of the day, they backed it. Back in 2017, I was going through a break-up and a really rough time and a friend took me to Green Lane Park and we just walked and talked about everything and anything. I remember it being such a beautiful park and it holds so many memories for me.
How we settled on the ("rock") location is a bit fuzzy. I barely even remember why "the rock" came into [play,] but I wanted to illustrate this form of "exhaustion," if you will—that feeling of feeling like you are dead, but you're still alive. To me, that was what the record felt like. Being so close to death, but still being alive. Fun Fact: there were a bunch of kids hanging on "the rock" and I paid them $20 to go find another [one,] so we could do the shoot lol.
IV. We saw that you recently visited "the rock" at Green Lake Park and took some "five years after" photos for the Five Years of Martyr show flyer. How did it feel being back there again? And how has the area changed since that bloody 2018 photo shoot?
Zee: It was wild. It's so easy for anniversaries to Copy and Paste old resources and call it a day, but I wanted to switch it up. After being given the assignment of doing the poster, I woke up the next day to the smoke from the wildfires at its peak. I, then, had this crazy and dumb idea to go out into it and shoot the photos. To a normal person, this is a stupid idea; to an artist, this is an opportunity that will never come again lol. The tree next to "the rock" fell, which made "the rock" a little tough to find and I, actually, had to FaceTime Tristan Wikler (guitar and vocals) to confirm it. The smoke gave [it] this gloomy "apocalyptic aftershock" feeling, if you will. Between the tree and the smoke, it gave this "return to where it all began with a new perspective" feeling to it.
V. In addition to and/or aside from yourselves (Billy, Tristan, Chris, Nick & Bryan,) who else was pivotal to the making-of and creation of AMORA's Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction?
Zee: James Hohenwarter for producing the record. Aaron Vasco for hopping on "11:19." Jorge Sotomayor, who is the singer of my favorite band, Adaliah; having him on "Hearthstone" was a wild dream come true. For the album art: Katya Ivanovski for photos, Sean Farrell for modeling, and Leah Sapp for make-up/blood patrol.
VI. What is or was the significance or intended meaning behind the album's title, Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction?
Zee: Martyr, the word, is someone who dies for what they believe in. In a way, it translates to the record as, like "I will do this, even if it kills me"—whether that's music or going through the hardships life throws at you. "Martyr" did feel a little lonely on its own and we made the idea to add "A Recital of Self-Destruction" to emphasize on the feeling and meaning of the lyrical content and coldness of the record.
VII. What is the significance and/or role of Panico's Neighborhood Grill & Sports Tavern in Lansdale, Pennsylvania within the "origin story," if you will, of AMORA?
Zee: I still remember when the album came out at midnight and we celebrated the record there with close friends, at the time. We were all fresh 21-22 [year olds] experiencing that lifestyle for the first time. Great times happened there [and] bad times happened there. It's kind of like the coffee shop [Central Perk] in Friends.
VIII. How would you say AMORA's overall sound, approach, musical outlook, style, etc. has changed and evolved in the five years since Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction?
Zee: For starters, taking things more seriously. Caring about your work, your production, your representation... caring about the details, but, also, not sweating the small stuff. Trying new instruments, avenues, and being open to criticism. [Surrounding] yourself with the right people to pull the best out of you, too. I was mulling over this today and figured it would work well for this answer: when you are younger and this whole "band life" is showing itself to you, it looks like never-ending touring/hustling because that's what your favorite bands did.
All you wanna do is be your favorite bands and follow in their footsteps, when in reality, a lot of that "never-ending hustle" leads to problems of many sorts and burnout. With the experiences we have all had in the music world since, it's shown that it's important to have balance, to be selective about shows/tours, not settle for less than what you deserve, planning ahead, [and] being hungry for more, but, also, being patient and cherishing what you have.
IX. Do you guys have any immediate plans to re-visit, re-record, and re-imagine or at least include some songs from Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction within your live setlists moving forward?
Zee: We bounce this idea around of doing an EP of re-makes from the In Lieu Of/Martyr[: A Recital of Self-Destruction] days and donating the proceeds to a charity or something. We have been more focused on this new chapter of us and how to grow the band more, though, that it isn’t there yet. We have, honestly, put a lot of songs from Martyr[: A Recital of Self-Destruction] to rest from the live sets, but always try to include 1-2 depending on time. After this show, I really don't know what's next for that record, as we have [the] Cutting Teeth [EP] (2022) and starting to write whatever will come next.
X. What does AMORA have planned to help celebrate the fifth anniversary of Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction?
Zee: Obviously, the anniversary show and, maybe, some new merch (wink-wink.) All these ideas were made within the last couple months, so it's hard to really put in so much in such a short amount of time, but this could be a cool trial run that opens some ideas for future anniversaries down the line.
XI. So, since AMORA is about to celebrate and acknowledge the fifth anniversary of Martyr: A Recital of Self-Destruction, do you have intentions to orchestrate something similar for the upcoming eighth anniversaries of In Lieu Of and/or Wrong from Right/Colors & Lights EP's in May 2024?
Zee: Maybe, not the eighth anniversary, but, maybe, for the 10-year of In Lieu Of—that would be a really cool thing to do. I still remember we did a one-year anniversary show in 2016 and headlined with a lot of our friends, at the time, in Pottstown. The show had an insane turn-out and we debuted a lot of the Martyr[: A Recital of Self-Destruction] stuff there. Sometimes, for hometown shows, we sneak those songs into setlists and it feels really good to play those songs with the equipment and knowledge we have now. Not to mention, the positive reception we get when we do play "Mackenzie" or even when we play "Hollow Bastion" and there are, like, five extra people doing the breakdown and [bassist] Nick [Magidson] & I swap mic and bass.
It is so easy to have fun with those songs. That being said, I personally would love to do it—like, the re-make EP idea I mentioned earlier. Those songs would have such a cool justice done recorded and produced with the knowledge and resources we have now. For Wrong from Right, the only way it would feel good and complete would be if Above The Mendoza got back together to do their side of the split and perform "Goodbye" with us. Maybe, that [would/could] be a cool encore/set ending for the In Lieu Of anniversary [show(?)]. Yes, this is a call-out, Pete Long.
XII. What's planned next for AMORA?
Zee: We're currently planning some shows and tours with some friends. We're writing and going to the studio soon. Starting to confirm/talk about some cool opportunities for 2024. While we do have [Fred Mascherino's] Heading East Records behind us, we’re still pretty D.I.Y. Being D.I.Y. is awesome—don't get me wrong. We want to start building a team and focusing on how to get to the next level we have been wanting to get to as a band.
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